Discussion » Dating & Romance » For China's Educated Single Ladies, Finding Lo

  • Checkered
    Checkered wrote:
    <p>From www.theatlantic.com.</p> <p><em>In a culture where women marry young and marry up, those who also want success for themselves frequently find that the deck is stacked against them.</em></p> <p>SHANGHAI, China -- Wei Pan, a 33-year-old biomedical engineer can't seem to find Mr. Right. A fresh-faced woman with an M.D. and Ph.D. under her belt, Wei should have her pick of men. She has tried everything: online dating, set ups, social clubs like Toastmasters. She even took her search to the outdoor marriage market at Shanghai's People's Park, where, every weekend, parents of the unwed blanket the park with their children's resumes. Wei, who went with her mother, was disappointed that few singles actually showed up.</p> <p>&nbsp;</p> <p>But it gave her a chance to scope out her competition. The resumes fluttering from taut clotheslines relayed the hard facts: age, height, education, property, salary. As she read through them, Wei realized that many of Shanghai's single ladies are just like her: highly educated, career-driven, and not getting any younger.</p> <p>&nbsp;</p> <p>The Chinese media has been buzzing with stories about urban single women like Wei, so-called sheng nu, which literally translates to "leftover women." While countrywide, the gender imbalance, which tallies up to an average of 120 males for every 100 females, might seem to favor women, there's another force working against this class of ladies. The country's long-held tradition of marriage hypergamy, a practice in which women marry up in terms of income, education and age, means that the most highly-educated women often end up without partners. Under these conditions, "men at the bottom of society get left out of the marriage market, and that same pattern is coming to emerge for women at the top of society," says Yong Cai, a University of North Carolina demographer who studies China's gender imbalance.</p> <p>&nbsp;</p> <p>In a cheeky response to the mocking title, women have launched "sheng nu" social clubs across the country. At a Starbucks not far from Shanghai's People's Park, the founders of one such club, which boasts more than 1,000 members, met on a hot summer night to talk about single living in Shanghai. As women climb the social ladder, the pool of viable men shrinks, explained Sandra Bao, a co-founder and fashion magazine editor who coyly said she's "around 30." She noted that many modern, single women in China enjoy their independence and feel comfortable holding out for the right man, even as they grow older. "We don't want to make compromises because of age or social pressure," she explained.</p> <p>&nbsp;</p> <p>Universal marriage at a young age has long been the norm in China. So it's not surprising that these women face criticism for choosing to stay single, especially as the countryside fills up with men who can't get married because they outnumber marriage-age women. Viral videos, newspaper articles and commentators across China have lambasted these women for gold digging, blaming them for waiting it out for a man with a bigger house or fancier car.</p> <p>&nbsp;</p> <p>But Wei says it's not that simple. Browsing through stats like education and salary is precisely what turned her off the People's Park scene, she says. Sometimes, men are intimidated by her accomplishments. Six years ago, on an online dating site, she met a primary school teacher who hadn't even completed college. After many long phone calls, she could sense a spark. When they met in person, she started falling for him. But soon after, he pulled away. She still doesn't understand what went wrong.</p> <p>&nbsp;</p> <p>The "sheng nu" phenomenon is similar to trends we've already seen around the world, in countries ranging from the United States to Japan as higher education and increased employment give women more autonomy, Cai says. Women break away from the tradition of mandatory marriage, get married later and have fewer children, studies show.</p> <p>&nbsp;</p> <p>Wei holds out hope that she will find a good husband. She doesn't need a rich man, but she wants someone who can match her intellect, her passion and hopefully, her salary, nothing too unreasonable. "I'm not a perfect lady," she says. "So I do not need a perfect man."</p> <p><em><br /></em></p>
  • 随便叫兽
    随便叫兽 wrote:

    Not coincidentally, societies that discard their leftover women often have exquisitely refined original recipes for battering them as well.

    I openly express contempt and hostility to the concept of marriage, but I'm aware of the social realities ladies must face in what is a deeply unequal and patriarchal society. Do whatever, womyn. So, not unlike human paraquat Pete McBrostein, I also respect women who make the decision to define themselves according to their relationship with a man.

    But I would prefer if such shallow people would remain within the cloisters of their gated communities so as not to infect the rest of the population with their social disease by promoting their unnatural aberrance as exemplary of "true love," or whatever the cool kids are calling it these days.

  • patrick or 潘云迪

    This seems like quite a landmine filled conversation. While reading through the whole conversation I didnt really pick at most peoples points however, I do think women should be free to do what ever the hell they want and I think guys should just get back their confidence and stop acting like women. Actually according to chinese medicine in the old time females were given yang medicine and males yin medicine to balance them. BUT, one famous TCM doctor said that guys are becoming more like girls these days and that the medicine precribed for them wasnt working but when he tried the yin medicine it worked. SO there you have it, Most modern men need to get a pair and then im sure they wouldnt feel intimidated by a girl having a higher wage or seeing out what she wants to do, As a self defense instructor and avid student of my master in beijing i know what its like to put one before the other, And when back in Ireland I really know that it pays off, and I'm happy with my life decision and we are all entitled to our own life decision no matter what it may be.

     

    Patrick

  • 叮噹叔叔 (令狐叮噹)

    ...

    Hahahahaha ... no offense, Patrick, but since when (and why) do people leave "signature" in a post? That's kind of strange, but then many things are strange in this world ...

    Joan ... Single guys just want date, don't want marrage ... not true ...

    Wei ... 叫Wei的都是剩斗士么 ... not true either, heehee ...

    ... and whatever Adam said ... mostly true, but yes, very sad ...

    Joan and Catherine ... as I explained yesterday (and many times before that), marriage is a phase of a relationship, but it is not for everyone nor is it for every relationship, and it is NEVER a necessity ... but, besides Chinese, many people do assume that to be the case, and questions such as "hey, when will you two get married" also appeared in the western culture, from parents and friends ...

    Mooney ... "But why do men fear marrying career-oriented women" ... the pre-marriage fear is nothing compared to the post-marriage fear, heehee, even my wife agrees with this ...

    Anyway, the title of this article should be about marriage, not love ...

  • 叮噹叔叔 (令狐叮噹)

    ...

    (continued) ... hahahaha ... you “kids” were perhaps shielded from this SNAG thing then? I am still trying to get over this ...

  • 叮噹叔叔 (令狐叮噹)

    ...

    (continued) ... heehee ... it stands for Sensitive New Age Guy ... to get guys more in touch with their feminine side ...

  • Jenny&King
    Jenny&King wrote:

    single。。。。realtionship....wedlock。。。。。economy。。。。。political 。。。。mix together=complicated..............so i don't know how to handle it ....i will ask Siri : Would you like to share the life with me ? haha

  • Father Of Boring

    Oh please.  I saw this when it was published and almost smashed my computer.  

    If a woman is judging & rejecting men based on paper statistics, she deserves to be alone.  That's for baseball cards and WoW, not husbands.  If you want to marry "up" rather than get there on your own merits, don't be surprised when he treats you like shit.  He is, after all, paying you for the privilege.

    Same goes for men.  If a master's degree scares you, wait until you hear how some countries have female presidents.  

    But here's what really gets me pissed about this: what idiot of a man is actually out there thinking, "I want a woman stupider and less capable than I am."  That would be a man who wants to, as it were, treat a woman like shit.  

    This belief system leads to nothing but misery.  Let's kill it please.  

  • Father Of Boring

    RE: SNAG - Got that from mom and the macho man treatment from dad.  So now I shout, namecall, swear, and get defensive at people when they're not in touch with their feelings.  "WAS YOUR FUCKING INNER CHILD DROPPED ON ITS HEAD?  CAN'T YOU SEE I'M TRYING TO DISASSOCIATE MY FEELINGS ABOUT YOUR ACTIONS FROM MY FEELINGS ABOUT YOU HERE?"  

  • Jenny&King
    Jenny&King wrote:

    haha make it simple======back to human nature.....

  • Saint - Spartacus

    i never worried about the other's opinion , @ devonye , you've a 19 years old  vision , that's good for a young fresh thinking , but u gonna change in 10 years by the forces of times ...   

  • Pavoir Sponse
    Pavoir Sponse wrote:

    I am also inclined to avoid particularly career-driven women. Somewhat sensibly, they are also inclined to avoid me...

  • 随便叫兽
    随便叫兽 wrote:

    Right on, @Pops. I think Chinese women are considerably less likely to marry "down," which isn't all that unusual where I'm from (my parents both remarried like this).

    I can understand a certain amount of pragmatism in seeking a marriage partner in societies with massive gaps of inequality, but I feel no sympathy at all for well-educated middle class women who nonetheless feel compelled to marry "up," just as I've got no sympathy for dudes who married "down" only to lose everything in the divorce.

    Career-driven women avoid me because I'm a dirty hippy.

    I think I missed the SNAG boat. My mother and grandmother are both aggressive and empowered quasi-feminists and my normally reactionary father is considerably more progressive than the rest of the rednecks when it comes to gender issues. However, my feminist principles are strongly informed by post-binary gender and queer theory, and those faggots don't give a fuck about your bullshit feelings. Bitch up.

  • High Priest
    High Priest wrote:

    I like the approach of this so called Sheng nu in Shanghai. She didn't have high standards in searching for a husband, I read she dated a primary school teacher, she loved him but the guy got scared and ran away.

    I'd recommend some people to visit the Philippines. It's a country where for me, most women have genuine love. U would see a PhD lady working in the office, and the husband working as floor manager in the same company. While they are walking on the street, u'd see how this PhD lady is hugging her husband without shame.

    U would see offices plenty of women; and men, may be not well educated, staying home and doing housework. It could be an extreme instance, but my Idea is that men who got no much education, shouldn't be intimidated by ladies who are educated. Love and Education are two separate things. Some ladies don't care who you are and what u have, they are just seeking someone to be with.

    Someone said upstairs that marriage is not necessary, who said so? No one should be forced to marry, it should be a feeling and a desire from whoever gets it. There's time in life most people feel that it's time to settle with someone; there's no exact time, but this time surely comes and people decide to do so.

    There's nothing wrong in remaining single too. But, here I call upon the ladies on this site. U would say that now as u still look good; as that each night u get a call to date someone in Bar blue or Blue bar. Just because ur breasts are still standing still and ur face got not enough wrinkles. In ur 40s, u get it hard for some males to even look at u, and call u to ask even ur name. Then if u didn't secure a man who could be standing by you, u may suffer all ur life. Oh unless u are used to vibrators and stuff like that. But am not talking about sex only, a husband is someone who can be ur assistant in different situations.

    So, don't be just shouting there: Singleness is fine! I want to be free! Think twice how really ur future would like to be. Don't be too picky, I mean boys and girls. I encourage people to marry. Marriage brings stability, marriage is not rosy, it's new path, wich has highs and Lows.

    By the way, anyone could help me get Condoleza Rice contact number?

    High priest__Women Advocate

  • Saint - Spartacus

    this time i totaly agree with HP

     

  • High Priest
    High Priest wrote:
  • A豆腐
    A豆腐 wrote:

    manwhores and gigolos are gonna be emerging professions in China, I should become a pimp and begin to make money...

  • Shane
    Shane wrote:

    Well, I generally just try to be civil and be a gentleman, but more often than not it fails.

  • Micky
    Micky wrote:

    A Ph.D holder in a single academic field and a medical doctor who is higher?  I think it depends on how you play your cards while on your way to success. Sometimes ladies will ignore men completely hoping that when they achieve success that men will fly from heaven. They don’t know how to make a bed, they don’t know how to cook, they don’t know how to kiss, they don’t know how to console a man when the going is tough, and they just lack everything.

    So would you blame any man for not taking that risk?  What’s wrong with the lady living her life with her books? Why has man become so important? Why going to the park to look for resume? @HP ever cared to know why the teacher ran away? Of course when he saw the true color of the educated lady

  • Mengmeng
    Mengmeng wrote:

     lol, ageless theme of love. Even after ages, Socrates' wisdom of marriage never fails. I think match is chance, it depends on luck.

    I recalled some funny pics...
    nice, I find them: The sexual dilemma of the Chinese woman

    
    Decisions, Decisions

    
    The Player

    
    The Matchmakers

    
    Nouveau Riche

    
    2nd Generation Rich

    
    The Blue Collar

    <img src="http://www.littleredbook.cn/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/littleredbook_choices7-460x326.jpg" alt="" w

  • Mengmeng
    Mengmeng wrote:

    (the above pic)The professor


    The Freak


    The perv


    The Queen

    The Guy with OCD

    
    The Teenager

    
    "The Classy Guy" (The Vendor)

    After these NO NO NO...
    
    The Independent

  • Virgil W
    Virgil W wrote:

     

    I think that most have at little of each within and therefore we will succeed in love...Except 4 big boy classy since he has bigger breast,  no homo.

  • Joligne
    Joligne wrote:

    I have a friend, a 32 yo virgin. Very average looking. Not pretty at all you could say. She is desperately looking for a husband, and she never had a bf before.  How pathetic she is, I believe that will be most of your thinking about her. I honestly think that she really missed out many things in her life. When you get older, you will never think like a young, naive, romantic little girl. Because you worry about how other people may see your behaviors is quite at variance with your age. It will be harder for her to find her ideal husband, because we aren’t get any younger and will see thing more from a practical side.

    I think many Chinese are experiencing their inner contradiction of doing things traditionally, while they are actually living in a westernized society in China.  After 30 years, this kind of phenomenon will be gone. When the old people die, the new generations won’t have their mental pressure from their parents and their relatives and neighbors anymore. They can finally start to think on behalf of their own happiness.

    No matter if you get married or not, we all need sex, need a bf or gf. I was wondering those girls are “left behind”, what are their purposes of getting married. if marriage is simply meaning that u have to lower your standard to find a guy who will never betray u and promised will be with u and support each other when u grow old together?  Stop believing this shit and start to face the reality. You are the only one that you can count on to make yourself happy. No matter how much unhappiness you will have to go through on the road when you are searching for a cheerful result. You just never stop having hopes and never lose your goals. Life is not boring; life is how you make it.

     

  • Kristian Svoren

    at High Priest...thumbs up !!! You exactly pop it out and thats how it should be. i guess most of us, we really dont understand. all we do is that we just look at it form one angle and at our level of understanding it...."think twice like he said".... let's learn from the "Priest"!!!

  • High Priest
    High Priest wrote:

     @Mr Brave, xie xie ni. People should be warned 

  • Joligne
    Joligne wrote:

    that girl in the pic is really pretty. i wonder if she is real.

  • 随便叫兽
    随便叫兽 wrote:

    *Golf claps* for @High Priest and @Joligne. There's hope for you yet.

    ...

    The individualist philosophy implied by my Chinese name notwithstanding, I agree that people need people. I'm a confirmed bachelor, but "no strings attached" relationships have always struck me as something of an unrealistic male fantasy.

    It's not impossible to have a sexual relationship bereft of emotional connection or mutual understanding, but it's certainly not fun from even the most cheerfully hedonistic perspective. Sex is always better with someone you care about, and therein lies the most vital comparative advantage of committed relationships.

    However, I think there is too much of a push in modern society for people to look at marriage as imperative as a matter of economical pragmatism. This is especially common for women in rapidly developing countries, for whom marrying rich is safer than competing with men on an uneven playing field. Of course, rich men in these societies are all too willing to exploit this by lavishing gifts upon beautiful would-be trophy wives who are half their age.

    And while marriage does offer certain pragmatic advantages for both parties, it's nonetheless probably the single worst reason to get married. Excluding entire swaths of decent human beings because they are of lower (or higher) socioeconomic status is utterly unromantic.

    So, those rich bitches who are willfully seizing the 'leftover women' label probably deserve to be alone, especially if there are plenty of Sensitive New Age Guys who wouldn't be threatened at all by marrying a comparatively wealthy and educated woman.

  • Ajantha Manohar

    These fucking chinese, always talking about how to find love... the same shit in their songs, in their poems, in their movies, in their forums... and later they don´t give a damn shit about others or the world...a little kid is dying on the streets while they walk on by without offering any assistance....

    Before find love, you should find your own heart.

     

    TROLL MODE: ON

  • 随便叫兽
    随便叫兽 wrote:

    Polyandry would suit China's population dynamics better than polygyny.

  • Joligne
    Joligne wrote:

    someone can tell me why I didnt break this thread too?

  • Joligne
    Joligne wrote:

    maybe it's the virus attack that did to this website. not me .

  • 随便叫兽
    随便叫兽 wrote:

    This is why we can't have nice things.

  • Joligne
    Joligne wrote:

    and i didnt break this thread too.

  • 随便叫兽
    随便叫兽 wrote:

    That only proves that you're selective about which threads you ruin.

    ...As does the fact that you temporarily ruined this one and edited it post-hoc.

  • 叮噹叔叔 (令狐叮噹)

    ...

    (continued) ... hahahaha ... Joligne has a twin ...

  • Saint - Spartacus

    Joligne in my opinion is a stupid person , but every one have their own sight for a life ... ..

    one of my friend hit 35 years old , sigle & virgin , she's a talent beauty , just doesn't find the same type of person ... ... i do not think a virgin lose anything in life , as you have right to get the experience to smoke , to take drugs or not at all .

    it's a individual need , depends

    the girl in that picture will never catch my eyes, coz that's an artificial tool , noting to see about beautiful , be beautiful have nothing to see with a barbie body ... 

  • Brenda Liu
    Brenda Liu wrote:

     Joligne  is famous now

  • Lynn
    Lynn wrote:

    there is no suprise for me that highly educated women having trouble finding their love, everyone could have that problem, regardless your education. afterall, thats just one single determine factor of relationship.``personality`` matters much more. those women might need some other knowledge outside their profession, they need some hobby, maybe an adventurous attitude,open mind, loving heart...thats not something simply ``higher education`` can teach.

  • 随便叫兽
    随便叫兽 wrote:

    @Saintro, I wonder if they intentionally retouched those photos to make the model look like a wax sculpture. I mean, I'd fuck that, but I acknowledge that she is somewhere in that uncanny valley where the robots look extra-creepy because they look so similar to humans, yet obviously are not quite right.

    @Brenda, I think the proper word is "infamous".

    @Lynn, University students used to socialize with classmates of wildly different socioeconomic backgrounds. I think they're getting fewer and fewer opportunities to do that.

  • High Priest
    High Priest wrote:

    People should get it right, people should make a demarcation between high education and looking down on people. There is education and education. We go to school to learn how the world works and to comprehend it. We learn one plus one equals two. We then learn that the world turns around the sun.

    Then comes other things we can't learn at school. How to sit (I like it when some ladies wear only pants, because for them, when they wear a skirt or a dress, they tend to forget to close their legs), mothers at home teach them how to do sit well. Parents teach us how to consider other human beings, they teach us how to eat, to be humble, they teach us how to talk to others....these are stuff we might not learn at school and parents and the society would teach us.

    Let me tell you, any lady who doesn't know how to respect a man didn't get a good education from her parents. Man who doesn't respect a woman too, doesn't respect his mother, that means he was not well brought up.

    Please, let us not scare ladies who aspire to get high education and willing to settle down in her home. I know my Costa Rican Prof, his wife a PhD as well, she used to tell me: "I'm a Prof in the UNI, at home am a mother and my office is in the kitchen, I don't want my man to be much in the kitchen."

    They are happy and are to retire now.

    "-_-" Dando, there's no Hope for you yet.

    High Priest

  • 随便叫兽
    随便叫兽 wrote:

    "Dando, there's no Hope for you yet."

    Now, now, that's no way to take what was a rare and sincere compliment from a Dando. Why must you sour the atmosphere with petty vindictiveness?

    In any case, posting something surprisingly unretarded didn't prevent @Joligne from proceeding to bomb a couple of threads she didn't like. Likewise, I'm sure your newfound acceptance of women's liberation will crumble to ash the instant one of your homeboys gets accused of sexual harassment.

    From what I've heard, there's a guy here named KC1 doing just that via private messages. According to some of my female acquaintances, he's one of your associates. I don't think anyone should be surprised. The confessional has always been a safe refuge for undesirables.

  • High Priest
    High Priest wrote:

    Dando, HP needs compliments from anyone but you.

    From what I've heard, there's a guy here named KC1 doing just that via private messages. According to some of my female acquaintances, he's one of your associates. I don't think anyone should be surprised. The confessional has always been a safe refuge for undesirables.

    U've heard? U shall hear, u didn't hear anything yet! Waste your precious time which could be utilized for something worthy, is that all that is left for u to do?

  • 随便叫兽
  • 叮噹叔叔 (令狐叮噹)

    ...

    Hahahaha ... 单独子儿 ... "Now, now, that's no way to take what was a rare and sincere compliment from a Dando."

    Q: when did you become a race, you evil clone, you?

    ... by the way, the GIF seems to drag the CPU ...

     

  • High Priest
    High Priest wrote:

    Weaker, I need them in group as they used to be. Will punch them still

  • 随便叫兽
  • 随便叫兽
  • 叮噹叔叔 (令狐叮噹)

    。。。

    Hahahahaha ... Pussy ... no, sorry, I wanted to come here sooner, but the Mini guy PMed me that your wife was concerned about getting AIDS from you, and I just got a bit carried away ...

  • 随便叫兽
    随便叫兽 wrote:

    My bad, @High Priest. Seems KC1 changed his name to Whisky, but I'm sure he'll change it again. There was a thread devoted to him a few days ago. Or don't you remember? You're on his friend list, after all. And I have it from a reliable source that he's the alter-ego of Bedtyger.

    But it's okay. Your church practices open communion.

    I'm really confused, @Michael. How can you tell the difference between a woman who is poor at indicating interest through body language, and a woman who is indicating her disinterest through body language? Is that some kind of "skill in interacting with women?"

  • 随便叫兽
  • 叮噹叔叔 (令狐叮噹)

    ...

    Hahahahaha ... PUAMOG (aka Shawn aka Leo aka ScounfulOfYou aka ... ) should definitely learn some :)

  • Checkered
    Checkered wrote:

    @ Rockstar, I am not dead. I'm merely an article smasher, never bother to discuss what I posted, because people usually didn't argue over it.

  • High Priest
    High Priest wrote:

    Dando, I got about 200 friends on my list. WHoever adds me, I accept. When I add someone and he or she accepts both are ok. I don't  have time to talk to all of them. Am a High Priest u know? High Priest

    U added me, I accepted the add, U deleted urself from my list, It even didn't give a shit. Aren't we in a free world? Good u know that The guy u r talking is close to BT, that means u got one more supplier.

    But it's okay. Your church practices open communion.

    Come to Tian An Men Square when I will hold a Evangelist Campaign this Sabbath

  • 随便叫兽
    随便叫兽 wrote:

    At first you deny knowing him, yet you can confirm to me his close proximity to Bedtyger? I'll be Evanjellyizing all over you from inside a tank if I can be bothered to make an appearance at your crossitute convention.

  • Ataahua
    Ataahua wrote:

    for chinas uneducated single TALL ladies like me~~~~~~~finding date is often a struggle~~~~~~~~~~

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